Infighting in the Atheist Community??? Say It Ain't So, But Is It Bad?

Posted By on June 13, 2019



[Applause] [Applause] [Applause] [Applause] so this is going to be a little probably a little controversial because I don't shy away from controversial and top thanks I'm familiar on and that what I want to bring to everybody's attention is the controversy in the Atheist community right and I've been a part of this community for I don't know loosely we could say maybe a year or so about two years since I there a year and a half since I came out as an atheist about a year involved in the community and over that period of time there have been numerous fights within the Atheist community and without fail there are people who whenever anything happens between Chaya containers between people voices within the community anytime that any sort of confrontation happens yeah people come out that say we need to all just get along you know we need to stop this fighting we need to the Atheist communities to fractured we we've got to we've got to get along we've got a you know unite and fight and everything else and to me this this just reeks of ignorance whenever that happens because the Atheist community is probably the loosest the the loosest community you could possibly gather of people right there's one unifying factor in the Atheist community and that is a lot awkward disbelief and God depending on how you define the word there there is absolutely no other uniting factors right so your community is based around a disbelief not even there were for something but that we we disbelieve in something not only that one of the things that makes good communities is moral foundations right this is why religious communities United this is again why left and right politics United is you have to have a moral foundation in order to build a stable community we have none at the the the moral the ethical system atheists follow are wildly varied and so if you're somebody that's a consequentialist and you're weighing harm and benefit and you're talking to a deontologist you're not you're not even speaking on the same terms right because the people are gonna conceptualize things in different ways and the main thing that I want to get across on this is it's not a bad thing whenever arguments break out within the Atheist community because we're not arguing about atheism right there we may be arguing about how we treat religious people we may be arguing about we view race relations we might be arguing about trans topics we might be arguing about universal health care or politics or any of this right you're not arguing about atheism and so to say that and this was touched on earlier but to say that because we all share a disbelief in God that we need to toe some sort of line is is a religious holdover right I can't conceptualize it in any other way it's it's either because you're viewing things as an in-group out-group and and the groups are really really loosely oriented so we're never gonna have the cohesiveness that say Christians are other religious groups have Buddhists any any other religious group any religious group that prescribes a moral code we're never gonna be on that level and nor do we want to be because the other important thing about atheism is is that allows for critical thinking it allows us to form our own opinions without super natural biases clouding our judgment right and so it's important that these disagreements occur and it's important that we don't toe these lines simply because we're atheists it and and there should be no there should be no sentiment that we shouldn't argue with other atheists because we're all atheists because these these topics aren't about atheism period exactly I I think people people will know I'm in total agreement with that one what I oftentimes will see is people jump in and they'll they'll tag both of the people in a in a post we've got to get along that has never worked please don't do that that does not help that just that just brings things back to a head and you know like like like Evan said there we agree on one thing and even we it's been mentioned in the chat we don't even agree on the definition of that one thing half the time there are people out there that will say that I being a strong atheist that will say I don't believe in gods and I believe no gods exist that I'm going too far yet don't do that and no that's ridiculous this is what I believe there are people out there will say don't say believe because that's religious well I say believe there there are people dumb there's no way about it if you have ever said you shouldn't believe you're dumb and I'm speaking to you as well or in raw but but yeah there's like when you're when you're a group around something that you don't believe in it tells you absolutely nothing about the people in the group you can group around humanism because that has set principles you can group in religions you can group in in all manner of things you can even group in your favorite sports team because you're rooting for that favorite sports team but when you're rooting for we don't believe in mustard on sandwiches well then what uh what do you believe what exactly do you believe here and because it doesn't tell you if people like mayonnaise it doesn't tell you if they like ketchup it just tells you they don't like mustard mayonnaise we do have X was in here that's anti mayonnaise and I I like mayonnaise so I'm Pro mayonnaise actual Mayo not that not that like Miracle Whip shit I like actual Mayo snarky likes Miracle winner no nobody can say we don't disagree I would just like to ask hashtag Evans it okay if we cancel snarky okay I forgot hashtag no I don't know it's like you you can like you can try to make these groups around things that you simply don't believe or that you don't like but here's what happens you end up with fights you end up with with fractures it's going to happen there's no way that you can unite about one thing that you don't agree on I'm telling you it's fine it's gonna be okay the thing about it is is groups operate best whenever they have a moral foundation with on which to stand we're all friends on this panel because we share a lot of the same moral foundation so we believe that you know people are individuals we believe that their rights should be respected we believe there are plenty of things that we can say our moral judgments that we stand on humanism is a good instance of this you can you not human isn't easy because it's a system of ethics right that is atheistic in nature or secular in nature but it's something that you can unite around atheism itself is it just doesn't work it it's not something it's not enough of a it's not enough of a moral foundation to create a community around and so fights within the community are perfectly fine you know and they they they're going to happen they should happen and and it's it's one of those things it's like any other stance that you take you're gonna lose friend game friends and and you've got to be fluid and to realize that not all people agree and not all people agree all the time you shouldn't have to subject yourself to staying friends with someone that you don't like just for the sake of how it appears oh yeah I've heard people say well what do you think it looks like to the Christians when atheists fight in their own community I don't care damned Christians fight amongst themselves all the time that's what there's thousands of denominations I have just misters that fight against each other and they both go to the same freakin church so you're not gonna get the same kind of group cohesiveness but but the notion that because this other group may think differently I don't do what I do I don't believe what I do on the basis of what another group thinks about me you know and again that's another thing that's against you should be who you are you're your individualism should take precedent over what other people think about you I don't give a good goddamn what the Christians think of the Atheist community right because I am NOT again it's one of those things that I'm you know I'm against broad brushes we can we can recognize that the Bible holds a proclivity to do terrible things and we can also recognize that Christians don't follow that as a general rule I mean once again on this we have to kind of preface and say that we're not saying you can't be an atheist and not be a humanist that's that's not what we're saying what we're saying is if you want to build a community that's respectful and that's respectable you're going to do it through a moral foundation you're not going to do it through the one thing that you all happen to agree on and that's a negative that ya don't believe in God and I say this as somebody as that's part of the Atheist community right that's community that identify with but the general conception needs to be that the Atheist community is such a broad category that it doesn't tell you absolutely anything about that person other than that they don't believe in God you know and whenever we in the Atheist community act like we shouldn't be in fighting it's it narrows the scope in such a way that we don't even want it narrowed yeah it's it's really weird because it's like what do you wanna cult if you want to join a cult where everybody agrees with everything and then do that like not you can't dictate how what people believe oh oh but they don't believe anyway the thing is the thing that people are going to want to know what you stand for yeah what you stand against okay no one wants to know like if someone says what kind of music do you like I hate this band I hate country music know what music do you like I hate country music right that doesn't tell you anything yeah and that's why a lot of times you'll see atheist pages are reduced it just means about the same ol shit over and over again and the same with the Atheist YouTube channel so have to move on to like something humanism or I don't know freaking out over feminists you know it well and it's like you know with my two sisters one of them I know will will never watch my content because I'm an atheist the other one I sent her my Jesse Smollett thing and she said that's great I love seeing you talk about things you're passionate about you know and and those were our butting heads at times because of the way that they kind of look at people and you know I hate to say it but sometimes judge people I so you know that and that's uniting over something they do believe in so of course people who are uniting over something that they don't believe in are gonna have differences right and it shouldn't be said that you know if you do have principles and he voice those principles and you push back against atheists that you're being divisive fucking hate that oh I I realized that I don't have a moment of all this week so I'll give you a moment of awe and it's just going to be this thousands of angry men are out there today because the new Star Wars trailer came out and Captain Marvel is going to be a big force in the New Avengers movie I think we all does they all deserve a moment of silence for the time but they are going to be in pain so let's go ahead just a moment of silence and that's enough and [Laughter] [Applause]

Posted by Lewis Heart

This article has 8 comments

  1. I think Evans was so very close to making the final step in saying that without shared values there isn't actually a community (I've never really seen strong evidence that there is at least). Having one thing in common doesn't automatically mean it is a community. I chose briefs over boxers – I don't feel like I belong to a "Brief Community" (without really stretching the waist band of the definition of "community"). Also, as he pointed out, the meaning of atheism isn't even that clear (despite what SM says). Hell, I consider myself anti-theist but don't ever really call myself atheist. Oh, and #FuckMustard.

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  2. I wouldn't saying it's 'infighting." That suggests that it's one community when we really all know it's two.

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  3. There's also the Maddie/GE/Suris thing and Kyle/Steve thing. Wish I knew more about these situations. I just want everything to go back to the way things were… (and I miss the peanut butter wars) Also? Mayo>Miracle Whip 😉

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  4. I'm in total agreement here largely on a philosophical basis wherein a positive claim is always superior to a negative one. A positive claim is more exhaustive than a negative claim.

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